EP 570 – So I Guess COVID Is Over?

TWiM_EP570_COVID_Guidelines_LDS_First_Presidency
Hailey Smith is here to talk COVID guidelines, Brad Wilcox, BYU news, new Tabernacle Choir initiatives, and affordable housing.

Well February flew by in a flash. Hailey Jones Smith is back in the studio to chat Latter-day Saint news, life, love, Utah’s housing crunch, and COVID. What more could you possibly ask for?

Latter-day Saint News

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Transcript

00:00.00
Geoff
Hey everybody what’s going on welcome to this weekend Mormons I’m Geoff Openshaw your founder and all the other end of the microphone over there is Hailey Smith I was gonna let you take see if you take the queue and just jump in it’s me.

00:09.70
Hailey
Hi oh ah, it’s me Hailey Smith

00:15.94
Geoff
You know her from the the once I was films and all sorts of other things. Hailey it’s good to have you with us again. How of a how you bet we last talked to you I think sometime before the holidays probably sure something like that. You’re like okay I believe you sure sure here’s that then.

00:18.17
Hailey
But yes, thank you for having me happy to be here. Okay yeah, no yes, yes, that was it I know.

00:35.34
Geoff
Yes, yes.

00:38.15
Hailey
Let’s see what have I been doing just you know just hunkering down I got a little touch of the Covid just a wee bit of Covid Um I did a hooked on phonics Commercial I know.

00:45.26
Geoff
Just some weak covid.

00:54.34
Geoff
I’m sorry what.

00:56.00
Hailey
So hooked on phonics is making a comeback. That’s what I said when I got the commercial but it hasn’t come out yet.

00:57.13
Geoff
I was about to say that’s that’s still a thing it exists are people still doing. How was the audition. How was the audition process for the hooked on Phonics commercial. How many callbacks were there I’m very curious about this.

01:10.29
Hailey
Ah, um I it will I don’t know it was. It was a group of people I’d worked with before so I auditioned um yes, no, um, yeah, it was. It was a really had a.

01:16.88
Geoff
Okay, well, there’s nothing wrong with that. They they wrote it with you in mind. That’s okay, that’s okay I.

01:29.87
Hailey
Had a really fun angle and but yeah I was could not believe the hooked on font I was like wait it wasn’t that it’s like been a good 20 years or 30 years since I’ve heard anything about hooked on phones. So yeah.

01:36.90
Geoff
A while now get given I know obviously your career has not only spanned the latter day Saint Realm but is hooked on phonics a latter an lds connection or all is that are there is that part of our realm. Okay.

01:48.59
Hailey
I I don’t think so I don’t think so this particular like production company has a lot of clients like like not just in Utah so um, they really liked their pitch and so yeah.

02:05.84
Geoff
Hooked on phonics is a um look they’ got a Wikipedia entry as well. They should oh they’re well they’re distributed by Simon and Schuster I mean that’s that’s the real deal here. It started in 1987 they have an mobile app. Oh my god.

02:12.79
Hailey
Um, yeah.

02:18.54
Hailey
Ah, it started 1987 okay I knew it was like I was hearing about it when I was a tween teen. But yeah contemporaries. Yes.

02:24.81
Geoff
I yeah yeah I mean you and I I think are close to the same age I imagine and yes we contemporaries I think we both did we both graduate high school in the 90 s you’re in the middle so you might be a little bit ahead of me. But yes I was at the I the tail end of it right there. But yeah.

02:35.72
Hailey
Yes, right in the middle. Yeah yeah I know same.

02:44.21
Geoff
That’s fun I can’t wait to see that commercial on the on the broadcast television I don’t watch where will I see in this is this gonna be trouble Youtube I’m gonna start searching a lot for hooked on phonics. So that way when I’m watching Youtube it’ll serve the algorithm will serve up a relevant ad I’m that way I can.

02:49.43
Hailey
Probably Youtube yeah.

03:00.90
Hailey
Oh yeah, is that oh that’s a good idea I should do that too.

03:02.33
Geoff
Want to capture that I my Youtube ads are ah are a bizarre mix right now I see so I do I mean I work in I work in marketing and advertising for a ah on a government contract for recruiting for a certain government agency. Um and now because I spent so much of my time like. Looking for stuff and things like like I see the ads now in my personal life like I’m scrolling on my phone and I’m like there’s that one we approved the other week there. It is in the wild It’s always a weird feeling when something you did for work is just like on the internet there with all its tracking links ready to go. It’s just it’s a strange feeling.

03:26.35
Hailey
Ah, yeah, ah.

03:33.19
Hailey
Ah, yeah, tell me about it.

03:37.66
Geoff
Does the man who’s been producing podcasts for over 12 years but yeah I did but oh well good I’m glad stuff’s going. Okay I’m glad that we covered didn’t last too long and i.

03:45.21
Hailey
Yeah, yeah, it got I was able to keep my college daughter home for an extra week so you’d think that I planted it on her but I didn’t we I.

03:54.10
Geoff
How you wanted this.

03:58.34
Hailey
Ah I was like oh you know to stay an extra week and snuggle with me and watch Tv. Okay, how many years

04:01.71
Geoff
I hope I get to that point meanwhile I’m like today’s president today’s today’s president’s day and that means I don’t have to work and my kids aren’t in school and we’re all together all day and I love them very much but but ah, they’re fun.

04:09.72
Hailey
But.

04:19.10
Hailey
Yeah.

04:21.10
Geoff
Well, we’ve got um lot of you know last week of course we had news. We talked a lot about Brad Wilcox last week thanks to those of you who tuned in to that one. We appreciated your feedback and if you haven’t listened to the show. Please do I’m hoping you’re aware of the Brad Wilcox Bruhaha if you’re not please go listen to that show. Lots’s gone down there. It seems like things have quieted down a little bit on the Brad Wilcox front we haven’t heard much more from him I did have 1 small followup to the Brad Wilcox situation so since we recorded the episode last week 1 more thing had happened b I use a black student union who.

04:47.59
Hailey
So okay, so.

04:57.82
Geoff
This was awesome. They they wore all black and they even took a picture in front of the brigham young statue. You know right? there in the main quad it looked like a black panthers photo in front of brigham young statue which was yeah which was just kind of awesome but their but their purpose was they went to bred Wilcox’s class and they wanted to like.

04:58.90
Hailey
Ah, yeah, yeah, oh in front of the statue. Oh wow. Yeah.

05:16.47
Geoff
Talk with him. They were not this was not like a violent rushing of pitch you know torches and pitchforks or anything like that under to go Brad Wilcox so they went to the Jesse Knight building and and they said when we got there, we were met with security outside the classroom door. Yes, the why you gave Brad Wilcox security detail

05:16.66
Hailey
Yeah, 1 question. Of course. That’s totally fair. Yeah, so they like they got their.

05:35.44
Geoff
And if you’ve seen pictures of these security guys. They look like they fell out of a vi out of a vivant ad um, it’s just brotastic and they’re they’re great people and but they’re just it looks like it looks like the most random security it’d evers seeks. It’s not like uniform people. It’s just like some guys.

05:40.57
Hailey
Oh.

05:49.96
Hailey
Oh oh okay, Wow. So oh what.

05:53.11
Geoff
And like black t-shirts with their phones just standing there like yeah, we’re gonna We’re gonna keep this legit. Um, anyways so they showed up. They were not allowed to go in and sit down. They said that where they were trying to force their way in which nothing happened but they did sit. Yeah, yeah.

06:08.43
Hailey
It was do while he was doing class or they’re waiting for class to be over like.

06:13.86
Geoff
Um, that that part is murky and me because it says they wanted to go in there and like sit down and have a sort of a dialogue. But obviously if it’s going into a classroom like I don’t I don’t think you need to disrupt a class if there’s one going on in the moment they said they’ were waiting calmly outside the door. We didn’t have any disturbance in the video bird says that they were able to meet with.

06:19.41
Hailey
Yeah, but yeah.

06:32.90
Hailey
Okay, yeah, yeah.

06:33.71
Geoff
Briefly after his class ended. So that’s fair, don’t don’t disrupt the class. You know that you don’t need to do that. But but their rep said Brad Wilcox didn’t want to have an extended conversation then and there but they could talk in the future which is good take the time take the time take the and.

06:44.38
Hailey
Know Yeah, well yeah, it’s a conversation that that needs to continue to happen like it’s not the conversation that you just go Oh well that came up again. Well you know push it back under the wreck this needs to be an ongoing conversation for sure.

06:50.64
Geoff
Listen and learn.

07:03.38
Geoff
Yeah, like we said I think credit to Brad Wilcox I think in many ways he’s a product of our time and certain cultural things and this not but and what we said last week he could ah just apologize for not just for.

07:04.40
Hailey
So that’s good.

07:16.17
Geoff
What if something he said offended somebody but like actually said no this content was like bad I think he’s but I think he’s been receptive to that I don’t think bred Wilcox has a ah malicious bone in his body or anything like that I think he’s and I think he’s.

07:23.70
Hailey
Yes, no, he strikes me as a very good person a very loving well-meaning person. Yeah, it’s yeah yeah, yeah.

07:30.22
Geoff
And he strikes me as someone who wants to learn from his mistakes and do better and so I hope he but I hope he does and I hope it’ll be a ah call to all of us to likewise do better if we’re not doing better so that was our last update that might wind up being the last update on Brad Wilcox front unless like.

07:40.26
Hailey
Yeah, no.

07:47.73
Geoff
Something crazy happens and the church releases him from the young men’s press you know, like hastily reorganizes the young men’s presidency in conference but they were like barely put in there. So I don’t think that’s gonna happen that would that would be pretty ah pretty obvious I can’t believe conferences only like five weeks away now cheese. It’s already to that’s already.

07:54.43
Hailey
Yeah, probably not. I Know that’s true that means spring is coming. That’s fine I’ll allow it. But.

08:07.29
Geoff
That’s what they tell me, we’ll see we’ll see so so that went down. Um we have a lot of other byu stuff though this week I guess we could get into some of that. So if it’s a little bit older than other weeks but we haven’t talked about it because last week was a lot of Wilcox week before that we had our interview with Tyler with a fever.

08:10.36
Hailey
Yeah, yeah, okay, okay, yeah, ah yeah, this um week I asked a friend I was like hey whatever happened with that.

08:24.43
Geoff
Um, so.

08:29.50
Hailey
Title nine suit I I heard oh it got dismissed I didn’t and I hadn’t known that so just learned about that.

08:34.13
Geoff
And what was the context and what was the context on this one. It was that I believe the the argument was that because this was the department of education was allegedly was investigating byu for title 9 violations is particularly that they allegedly were not treating. Um, lg b t q and students the same way like we’re not yes.

08:53.10
Hailey
Yeah, that they were being discriminated against and apparently the complaint was filed last March but buu wasn’t aware of it until October when they were given notice that the case was opened. Ah yeah.

09:05.97
Geoff
Hu So they go that long without even telling them what’s going on.

09:12.94
Hailey
But you know I guess it was dismissed because they did assert you know their religious exemption. Um, so you know that was they’re able to close the case because B way you has religious exemption that applies to this issue. So yeah.

09:29.20
Geoff
It seems pretty cut and dry I didn’t think anything was gonna I didn’t think anything was gonna happen with this specifically because of the religious exemptions to title nine like what was they gonna do just say no, you don’t have that anymore.

09:31.50
Hailey
And I yeah.

09:38.86
Hailey
Well and it did mention that there are there are there are several institutions that have these religious exemptions which kind of made me curious about like just how many you know educational institutions are exempt from. Um.

09:58.30
Geoff
And you can read. There’s a lengthy letter the department of education actually sent over and they say very clearly we reaffirmed that the first amendment to the us constitution protects the autonomy of religious institutions including byu to be free from government involvement in the teaching or practice of religion.

09:58.61
Hailey
Title nine requirements.

10:17.62
Geoff
And from excessive entanglement in their religious affairs further federal law prohibits the government fromosing any substantial burden on a religious free exercise. It is not the least restrictive means of meeting a compelling government interest. So that’s that’s the gist right? there I mean then they say title 9 is designed to eliminate with certain exceptions discrimination on the basis of sex. And any education program or activity receiving federal financial assistance. But anyways, they basically say yeah, don’t be away. He’s got its own definition of things howline does not apply discrimination on the basis of sexual orientation or gendered identity and because by you as you said Hailey has the religious exemption we can link to this. Full version if you want here. There’s a lengthy back and forth here of letters from the church and back and this and that and everything but that that’s some of the I guess this the original one that they sent to them. Wow oh boy they actually send them the family proclamation b why you sent as exhibit four and it’s in its package like I don’t know if this’ like an am.

11:01.17
Hailey
Yeah, for me. Ah I Yeah I mean I think it would be interesting to go on to campus and talk to the students and see what they think about the situation because like.

11:15.37
Geoff
And.

11:21.61
Geoff
I Just liked that they said no you know what we’re gonna do guys. We’re gonna send them the family proclamation that is our defense and apparently it was apparently it worked his official but not yet.

11:32.76
Hailey
It’s an official proclamation.

11:37.47
Geoff
Ah, official declaration 3 and the doctrine of covenants as many people think or or would ah assume another thing going down has gone down here byu in recent weeks so ah you’ve probably seen this.

11:40.34
Hailey
Who.

11:51.98
Geoff
I can’t believe we haven’t talked about it I think the sisters might have spoken about it a little bit but basically the idea is the church educational system announced many weeks ago now that all employees who are members of the church of Jesus Christ of latter day saints will be required to hold and be worthy to hold a current temple recommend that was very curious to me because they’re basically saying like it’s not enough to have the temple recommend. Have a temple recommend and yeah, like so have some issues but it’s not set the level your temper recommend will be taken away but your bishop is saying like you’re not worthy to go the temple right now. But I’m not taking your recommend away. Sorry I just I get lost in words. But I think it’s funny. You have to be required to hold and be worthy to hold the recommend church members already working at Cs.

12:22.78
Hailey
Um, yeah, yeah.

12:30.74
Geoff
Solutions will be invited to adopt the standard voluntarily so it applies to all new employees. Um that there if you’re already where you are invited to adopt. It’s an invitation like a lot of things we invite you We invite you to.

12:34.94
Hailey
But not current employees. The current ones are just you’re invited. Okay, so okay, so in the past church employees have had to have ecclesiastical endorsements right.

12:50.27
Geoff
And that’s been the deal if you’re a Ces employee you had to have an ecclesiastical endorsement to hold a job. Yeah, which is.

12:54.73
Hailey
Okay, and I only remember like my ecclesiastical endorsement from my bishop when I was going to be why you? But how? what like what kind of things did they was it an interview where or where they ask you know or or is it just. Like them the bishop signing it and saying yeah no, they’re good.

13:14.33
Geoff
It’s a mix I mean if you remember the a lot of the parts of an ecclesiastical endorsement could parallel a a temple recommended in many many ways I’m trying to bring up if I can find some of the actual questions. Okay come on what is it now I don’t want to issue one come on lcr.

13:18.68
Hailey
Yeah, like it’s similar I would imagine.

13:31.75
Geoff
Just trying to find the wording. But basically that’s the gist of it I mean you know are you good? You support stuff I mean you know I knew many byu students who flatly lied about things because they didn’t want to get because you didn’t want kick kicked out of school cause if you lose your quickness endorsement. You’d be.

13:38.28
Hailey
Um, yeah, well yeah, and that’s the thing here. It’s like if you have your livelihood on the line. Um are you maybe a little bit more incur like inclined to lie a little bit I don’t know that’s would be a concern.

13:46.36
Geoff
The.

13:55.57
Geoff
I Could totally see that being the case I mean it’s hard because when your ability to attend you to attend your University is contingent upon you having that endorsement. There’s a little bit of bishop roulette there I mean and and I’m and I’m not condoning you know, breaking the commandments and I’m not even getting umbi use case for.

13:56.73
Hailey
I Would think.

14:06.00
Hailey
Um, yeah, yeah, um, oh yeah, um.

14:15.51
Geoff
For requiring an ecclesiastical endorsement. You know they have they have their standards that’s fine, but you can run into this little issue where like what if you you know heaven forbid who knows what it is I don’t want be too graphic here. But what if you’re like a guy you go out with a girl and you’re making it and you feel her up or something right? and I think for different individuals and different leaders that could.

14:15.88
Hailey
Right? yeah. Um, yeah. Yeah.

14:34.62
Geoff
Merit very different consequences and reactions and you could very well have one. Ah, one bishop who might be like all right? Well we don’t want to do that. Let’s try to be better. Let’s work harder and you know I’m here to help you if you need things. Let’s let’s work through this you could have another who’d be like you have dishonored your priesthood and I am not going.

14:38.10
Hailey
Aha.

14:51.30
Hailey
Yep.

14:54.19
Geoff
To be able to issue this to you and then you’re like cool can I still go to school and they’re like I don’t know you might have to be on probation or things like that that can be the hard thing because you just you know it’s not uniform across who the leaders are even though the questions are basically the same thing you know there’s the academic policy the dressing and grooming standards the residential standards honor code all that kind of stuff.

14:58.27
Hailey
Um, yeah.

15:07.95
Hailey
Ah, right right? So yes, so.

15:12.80
Geoff
Um, so that’s the fun thing So that’s the ecclesiastical endorsement I think this takes it to a new level though with it being.

15:16.64
Hailey
Well, that’s what I mean like it’s your it’s your like kind of private time with your spiritual leader but you’re also thinking I got to keep my job or I need to get this job or whatever I don’t know it. It seems to be a conflict of interest.

15:34.92
Geoff
I think a little bit I mean ecclesiatical norsements were a little bit less formal in that sense I mean the bishop. It’s guy meet with your bishop synncing up seeing how you’re doing and making sure everything’s okay, but a temple recommend’s highly formal and that literally means like and it’s and it’s multilayered to it means to like have your have your job. You have to pass the what? whatever 14 odd questions with your bishop.

15:36.70
Hailey
There. Yeah.

15:49.43
Hailey
Multilayered. Yeah, um.

15:54.64
Hailey
Aha no.

15:54.88
Geoff
And also with a member of a state presidency we’re hoping everyone’s in good standing and you can do that of course but it also makes your it’s kind of goofy because it’s like like what if you struggle to pay tithing if that’s your business. But if tithing’s a thing for you. You could probably have an ecclesiastical endorsement.

15:58.97
Hailey
Um, yeah.

16:11.81
Geoff
And not be a full tithe bearer but you can’t have a temple recommend if you’re not a full tithe pairer. That’s just an examplelthough’s someone I think is the funniest because by I is paying your salary and then you have to give 10% of it back to the church I continue being employed by by you. It’s in.

16:14.46
Hailey
Right.

16:24.38
Hailey
It’s just be like can you just give me a raises to cover like.

16:28.48
Geoff
Or you’re like can you just like cut this out at the gross level so you don’t I don’t have to waste my time with it just just shave it off the top it that way it actually lowers my taxable income upfront instead of later on. Um.

16:32.12
Hailey
Right? Yeah, just take it off with a yeah health insurance taxes tithing. Yes, ah.

16:42.85
Geoff
Yeah, and there’s an article over it by common consent by John S who kind of talks about a little of this like he says that 1 big issue. Of course you know it creates a transactional employment relationship and what should be an opportunity for counseling and spiritual growth. That’s the issue I would worry about too if you have sins that are at the level of you could not have a temple recommend and you need to work through some stuff.

16:49.33
Hailey
Yeah.

17:00.23
Geoff
Good for you for seeking guidance and good for you for 1 to work through those things. But if it means you as your temper recommend and you’re a cs employee then like are you going to work.

17:06.33
Hailey
Ah, yeah, well and it it really does give that leader that bishop that so much power over people over you know I don’t know so which I guess it just depends on who you have right? like you want to believe that everyone is. Good and well-intentioned and wants the best for you and but I’m sure there’s been situations and cases where people do kind of you know that power I don’t know. But. I Don’t know I can’t imagine it would It would be very difficult to be in that position I wouldn’t want that job. But um.

17:46.17
Geoff
That’s that’s tough I don’t know that’s tough I mean and and a lot alone and when you’re ah working ah for the church.. There’s already the whole like you know consecration idea that that from what I understand jobs are vary I’m sure. But and most the people I’ve talked to who are employed by the church and that’s the church Overall okay CS is a little. Subs this specifically applies to Cs But obviously if you are working for the church even in the IT department you have to have a temple recommend I mean that’s part of that’s the whole the whole big church apparatus and I feel like this is just kind of extending that more formally.

18:05.93
Hailey
Lost.

18:12.61
Hailey
Um, yeah.

18:19.92
Geoff
And to the byu realm If you’re a member of the church and if you’re coming on as ah, a new employee boy those people kicking themselves who didn’t manage to get that little that little offer a year ago right? The ones who really want to mess around and not have to keep.

18:24.68
Hailey
So a.

18:32.80
Hailey
Ah, well I know because if they they they tell current employees that they’re only invited and we know we know how that goes the words invite and urge are we’re like oh I don’t have to do that.

18:42.85
Geoff
Well I mean it’s funny like I had some polysy I I had one polyside Professor I think she was just adjunct. But um I knew that she was a member of the church but I knew that offline I think she like kind of like casually would have coffee and stuff here and there and wasn’t I don’t think she was I don’t believe she was endowed or things like that she was kind of Frank about it moring office hours and like.

18:54.62
Hailey
Um, Aha o.

19:02.50
Geoff
Okay, that’s her deal I valued very much her capability as as an instructor in her field of expertise and the things I learned from her classes and those were good so things like that are interesting to me because it’s this big like purity statement about like okay would would this individual no longer be worthy to share her knowledge with learning minds and.

19:05.80
Hailey
Structure the Zoom.

19:12.41
Hailey
Um, zoom.

19:20.90
Geoff
Might come at me for saying that and say look it’s the church. It’s by y you it’s the lord university you want to shore things up I know this kind of falls along with Elder Holland’s remarks last summer right? We need to protect BY you and what it stands for and this seems to be just a further extension of that.

19:22.20
Hailey
Um, yeah.

19:34.11
Hailey
Well kind of along similar lines. There was a byu professor that was fired and she believes it was because of her advocacy for lgbtq students Individuals. So I Thought that was interesting. Because um I think that would put a lot of people in kind of an uncomfortable position if they’re worried another reason to you know to worry about their job if they’re just um I don’t know I don’t know at to what level she was like being outspoken about her personal beliefs. But that’s I Think. Concerning that her she feels that it cost her her job.

20:16.85
Geoff
Thats great. Yeah, and it’s funny because she was an adjunct professor which is when you’re an adjunct. Um, it’s a very different situation for you. It’s almost like you’re kind of an ad hoc. You’re not like a so substitute but you are not a tenured part of the team right? And even though she she spent 28 years working

20:26.38
Hailey
Yeah, right, right? right? That’s a long time.

20:36.00
Geoff
That’s a long time to put up with being an adjunct professor for sake I would be like I mean adjuncts get the rough end of a lot of things if you’re tenured you’ve got even a byu you have certain protections if you’re tenured um the curious thing is for 1 thing she she can only guess that these were her views. This is by the professor’s name was is Sue Burgen um

20:42.13
Hailey
Yeah.

20:48.75
Hailey
Right.

20:54.36
Geoff
You can only guess because Utah is an employment at will state or what you? what’s known as a right to work state which means you can be fired and without cause and you don’t have to know why and you have no recourse really and so even though is a private school that part of things applies and you can be fired and they’ll just say sorry and you can say what did I do and they’ll be like it doesn’t matter.

21:13.38
Hailey
Who yeah.

21:14.50
Geoff
And they may never tell you but what she does know is that an administrator above her supervisor made the call and her department chair was instructed to carry it out and and the curious thing about this is that department chairs are usually the ones who make the calls on Employees. So She thinks someone even higher up at the school. Had an issue with something she might have shared online or in the classroom basically somebody higher up made a call and pushed it down and told somebody to get rid of her is it once again, her assumption. She’ll and she’ll probably never know you know that’s the thing.

21:38.60
Hailey
yeah right yeah yeah I mean I I don’t know if that’s the case I think that’s very unfortunate I mean it says she would wear a rainbow pin to let people she was. Let people know she was a safe person she would mention she had has 2 gay brothers I mean it sounds like pretty you know harmless just you know being a really good decent safe person and um, yeah I think we need more people like that vu not less.

22:14.63
Geoff
Especially because and of course bi would not comment on any particulars of it. They just said you know you’re always in a semester long contract and it could be renewed for many different reasons Carrie Jenkins who were who were convinced might actually be a real person I’ve wondered if if she’s just a bot that issues press releases.

22:14.78
Hailey
So.

22:18.80
Hailey
Yeah.

22:24.24
Hailey
Yeah.

22:32.43
Geoff
Because she seems not to have much of a presence other than care I don’t want K Jenkins job but ah yeah, be well you of like they’re not gonna comment on this. Why would they? they’re not gonna get into a mix of it. there’s no there’s nothing they’re going to do here new not at all. It’ll be curious see what happens with this I mean she asserts. She’s a.

22:41.66
Hailey
No, they don’t have to? yeah yeah.

22:52.17
Geoff
Faithful member of the church and it doesn’t seem I have never I don’t know anyone who knows her I’d love to know from our listeners if any of you guys know Professor Berggen or know anyone who does I’d be curious about the experiences with her. But if she was truly.

23:04.52
Hailey
Yeah, yeah, and interesting too in the in the Tribune article it. Um, it mentions that her dad was a psychology professor at but buu and championed the idea that homosexuals could make themselves.

23:06.71
Geoff
Teaching what the church teaches and not going beyond that and not saying anything out of turn then that’s that’s troubling. So.

23:23.19
Geoff
Oh good.

23:24.22
Hailey
Straight through self-discipline and then he he apologized for that. But I mean apparently he had 2 gay sons. So I’m sure that helped to change his stance. Um, but that’s yeah so interesting.

23:33.47
Geoff
So one would hope it took us a long time to even denoce conversion therapy as a church like a shockingly long time I’m glad we have but that’s yeah, product of a different age. Ah.

23:45.24
Hailey
Um, who yeah.

23:52.45
Geoff
Another byyu thing here folks this is a curious one that came out if you listen last week Jared and I were talking about like oh you didn’t want near the end like you don’t want to talk about that 1 thing and he’s like ah no, it’s all good and so I’m taking it right now Jared we were. We were a lot. We were been running very long on that episode because of brother wilcox. So um, this is a.

24:01.52
Hailey
Okay. Um, of course.

24:11.26
Geoff
Press release from the american speech language hearing association or asha asha I’m assuming it’s Asha um, that said it’s a statement on Brigham Young University Administration decision to deny speech services for transgender clients. So what we’re talking about here is ah this is an an organization an association you know professional association for speech therapists, speech pathologists, etc and most people in in many professions or members of associations and usually abide by a certain code of ethics pertaining to that part of it can be part of being certified for your position. And the issue here is they are alleging that bi is updated standards that now run contrary to the code of ethics of these professionals that might work for Byu. So the specifics of it here are the asha they say they recognize that you know gender affirming voice and communication services for transgender. And gender diverse populations within the speech they they they believe in you know doing that’s part of being a speech pathologist is helping people that might be transitioning genders. Okay, they provide vital clinical services to genders diverse populations who may have have voice or other speech language disorders unrelated to their gender That’s one part. As well as services to individuals whose voices do not reflect their gender transgender individuals who attempt to modify their voice without a trained speech language pathologist risk risk permanent damage to their vocal cords. Yeah.

25:31.74
Hailey
I Thought that was so interesting. You know I had never really thought about that aspect of transitioning of needing to work with a speech therapist but it totally makes sense. That’s.

25:40.46
Geoff
You and so basically saying like without appropriate services. You’re at an increased health. You also you just have a higher risk of mental Health challenges emotional health challenges and so their job is to ensure treatment for all individuals in need of Speech language hearing other related services including Transgender individuals is consistent with their code of ethics.

26:00.15
Hailey
Um, yeah.

26:00.45
Geoff
Sorry to lay some groundwork. There. The issue they have here is that their code of ethics says individuals shall not discriminate in the in the delivery of professional services or in the conduct of research and scholarly activities on the basis of race ethnicity sex gender identity or gender expression sexual orientation age religion. National origin disability culture language or dialect the issue with Byu is of course Byu is just not allowing their certified speech language pathologist to provide those sorts of services to transgender clients which makes sense from a church perspective because while the church. The church admits if you read handbook section 38 which actually love that the asa people actually dug up the handbook and quoted the handbook about this but you know they say as it says in the handbook transgender individuals face complex challenges, members and nonmembers who identify as transgender and their family and friends should be treated with sensitivity kindness compassion and an abundance. Of Christ -like love and it goes on to say some children youth and adults are prescribed hormone therapy by a licensed medical profession to ease gender dysphoria or reduce suicidal thoughts. Um, they’re pointing this out and then they they omit some of the other parts in that section. Basically the church is saying be compassionate to transgender individuals. But at the same time. The church has stressed that transgender individuals looking to change their sex could face church discipline. That’s part of what’s in section 38 section 38 of the handbook stresses that. Ah, you can receive priesthood blessings but you can only do it based on your gender at birth. So if you are a transgender woman I guess you could still get the priesthood because biologically you are a man you know that’s your sex at birth. Um, so so there’s some thorny stuff here I think this is just a really fascinating area in general where they’re basically saying.

27:37.18
Hailey
Right.

27:49.30
Geoff
You are like not doing this and also they say for the University to take action that the bans them from doing this the transgender Client’s protected health information would have been provided to the byu administration to do so which is a violation of the hippa privacy rule as well. So saying so.

27:51.32
Hailey
Yeah, um.

28:02.61
Hailey
Right? So it is a major call out by Asha is Asha Asha Asha Really no I know I hate it’s it’s I’m learning about them.

28:07.20
Geoff
Yeah I don’t know who this is the first time they’ve ever been in the news. So either way no I don’t know but you know this sad thing is my wife got her degree in speech pathology. So I should probably she probably is aware of thisso association existing. Yeah I think so.

28:20.46
Hailey
You know what my sister in law is a speech therapist I’m going to have to ask her about that now I would I would.

28:26.13
Geoff
She probably knows who they are so I don’t know this is this is a really curious area. Obviously I don’t understand a lot of the ins and outs of the code of ethics If You’re a speech pathologist. Um I understand Buiu’s position feeling like they’re sort of encouraging What the what would. You know error on the side of of I don’t know Troublesome behavior from a gospel perspective from a biu perspective basically encouraging those who are transitioning to further that experience So I kind of get both cases here I Just don’t know what the appropriate solution would be like it’s hard to tell byu. Well you need to provide the services I mean legally they probably should. But.

29:03.16
Hailey
Yeah I don’t know it seems like probably someone who’s considering you know transitioning there they’re they’re not going to be like oh well now I can’t get speech. Well I guess I won’t do it anymore. They I don’t know. But yeah, they it’s it.

29:05.91
Geoff
I Don’t know what is it.

29:22.31
Hailey
Ah, it’s a tricky position I don’t know I think.

29:23.73
Geoff
They They also remind byu that their master’s program is accredited by the council on academic accreditation and audiology and speech language pathology. Um I think they’re basically said kind of like saying like ah your accreditation in these programs could potentially be at risk because.

29:38.82
Hailey
Right.

29:41.18
Geoff
You might you’re violating some of these ethical standards im really I’m just curious this this was published on February Eleventh um I’m not I want to track this and see if anything happens. This isn’t the kind of thing that’s going to make the news I mean obviously this is just a press release I haven’t seen this picked up by any any angry form.

29:49.31
Hailey
Yeah, how well and is that like ah is that like a really is that a core Master’s program for vyu the speech language I don’t know.

29:59.86
Geoff
I Don’t know people I know who get masters in Speech language or pathology all the ones I’ve known might have gotten their undergrads at buu but did not go there for grad school. They all went to like northwestern or other places that have more notable programs. But I don’t know how be I use.

30:16.00
Hailey
Yeah, know that is interesting. Yeah I’m going to ask my sisterin-law who is a speech yeah pathologist but also not Lds. She’s catholic so ah, be interesting to hear think.

30:18.10
Geoff
Graduate program breaks on that front. So.

30:22.37
Geoff
First want to follow up on the. Ah, oh, what’s she gonna care I made I actually be I would be curious for her take because maybe like how is it for Notre Dame or some other school like are are they are they in a similar boat I’m always curious to compare bu’s the things biu works through in terms of.

30:32.72
Hailey
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

30:45.15
Geoff
Ah, discrimination suits and things like that along with other religious universities which face similar issues. We just don’t talk about them as much because we’re in our little Lds bubble right? I’m I’m curious.

30:51.29
Hailey
Again I do not want to be on faculty or Pr team do i.

30:57.88
Geoff
Why you you know every time I think I should just go live in Provo again I think I read the news and then I look at Utah’s real estate which has gotten absurd and that’s good. That’s another issue actually that um if I can digress for a second or maybe.

31:01.73
Hailey
Yeah, you read the News. So. Um, and then oh yeah, please.

31:16.57
Geoff
Obviously we all know globally the economy. Everything’s pretty wobbly right now I mean it’s it’s it’s difficult to come out of a near standstill of an economy that started back in March Twenty Twenty two and a lot. It’s a lot of other pieces have to come back together again I so one I hope people can remember that like this isn’t all falling on politicians shoulders.

31:21.76
Hailey
Aha.

31:30.40
Hailey
Yeah.

31:36.36
Geoff
It’s just that everything got crazy nearly two years ago and it takes a lot of time for things to normalize again, but still even with that you know there’s heavy demand on a lot of things that we don’t have enough of and the housing market of course has been all over the place I don’t know oh I mean come on hale you’ve probably seen your beautiful Colorado home quintuple in value.

31:37.72
Hailey
Right.

31:45.74
Hailey
Ah.

31:55.87
Geoff
Colorado market was hot even before covid ah, but I’m just talking.

31:56.49
Hailey
Ah, but it’s it. It has no sign of ever like it just is going to go up and up and up and up and you know we’re like oh when our kids you know I’ll graduate. We’ll move out of the suburbs by something else and we’re like we if you saw your house great.

32:03.67
Geoff
Stopping I want.

32:16.17
Hailey
But you can’t get back in anywhere like I guess I don’t even know where you could go you.

32:17.71
Geoff
So not unless you want to move down to Pueblo or some right and that’s the thing it’s it’s looking at Zillow right now is extremely depressing because you look at like random markets. You wouldn’t think would even matter as much you know so quote unquote flyover country and you’re like say what now like why are.

32:28.95
Hailey
Yes, yeah.

32:36.60
Geoff
Why are like the medium prices in Kansas City suburbs up to like six hundred and fifty thousand dollars like these were $300000 a couple years ago.

32:37.91
Hailey
Yeah, you know where is is not super and inflated. Um Ohio apparently I don’t know well yeah, my um, my yeah, my brother-in-law and sister-in-law out there their house like surprisingly has.

32:45.85
Geoff
So Columbus is still pretty bad though I think but Columbus is cool.

32:57.51
Hailey
Barely gone up at all in like 3 years like why are you in this just pocket of Ohio I don’t know.

33:04.00
Geoff
I have to imagine I know a lot of the hipsters have come to like Buffalo and Detroit you know because you can buy houses there for like $40000 I imagine that’s still so that’s some hardcore rust belt. That’s probably still doing. Okay.

33:15.78
Hailey
Mm Detroit nice. Yes.

33:17.44
Geoff
But my point to brit of saying any of this is I saw this on a a thread this week in a discussion board. Um, affordability should be an issue for a lot of us in Utah’s housing market has been blisteringly hot for for the past while and it’s gotten significantly worse during the pandemic. But. Utah for a long time I mean as a californian right? I knew plenty of people who are still able to do it because California’s market’s insane but you know you cash out in California built yourself that beautiful mcmansion in Highland live that dream. You know this is this is the stuff and you can still pull it off because your’re crappy postwar bungalow in California.

33:40.18
Hailey
Who has not.

33:47.34
Hailey
Yeah, yeah. Students. Yes.

33:52.36
Geoff
Still sells for one point two million dollars even though it has no business doing so but ah I wonder how much the church thinks about this. We like especially in Utah politics where the church weighed in on something a couple of years ago when they were looking at removing the zion curtain which is the little the divider means you can’t see where alcohol is prepared at restaurants in Utah.

34:08.82
Hailey
Oh.

34:11.13
Geoff
And there was a bill to get rid of it and the church actually made a video even about it and said like no, no, no, we should keep this. We should keep this and I think there’s so many interesting issues that the church chooses to get involved in at least in Utah politics I’m actually surprised we haven’t done more to talk about the housing crisis and affordability and like because they should care. I mean Utah is 1 thing where people are still moving there. They’re building temples like crazy but there are lots of places in the church that are contracting in the United States because people can’t afford to live there anymore. I mentioned my native California like the state I grew up in was dissolved this time last year

34:33.83
Hailey
Oh yeah.

34:47.51
Hailey
Right? so.

34:49.40
Geoff
And it was one of the oldest stakes in the southland and that specific people just can’t no one’s moving in and everyone’s moving farther in California they keep moving farther and farther east but even that gets too pricey. They go to Arizona even that’s getting pricey and I know in some senses it matters overall like well okay, the church membership will just migrate. But I just have to wonder how much.

34:59.48
Hailey
Yeah.

35:05.65
Hailey
Well yeah, and especially if you know they want us to get out of debt and and reduce our debt and but everyone’s yes and.

35:08.46
Geoff
1 they’ll be concerned about Utah and its housing issues that.

35:14.52
Geoff
And have single family single family incomes with mothers being in the home and those sorts of things of a.

35:22.80
Hailey
Everyone’s just getting more and more debt and I have a friend who’s in Utah right now who’s wanting to buy a house but she’s like I don’t understand where all these people get all their money from and I I don’t know I did live in a certain town for a couple of years there and I there was a certain level of. White collar crime in my ah and neighborhood.

35:47.50
Geoff
You’re not calling out pleasant growll but you’re calling out pleasant grove how? um but it was right around the doterra campus. Everyone knows it I I singled out highland man I’m good Highland is like a.

35:50.81
Hailey
That’s a grupp I’ll say you already mentioned it I will. That’s all I’ll say you already named it. Yeah Highland I don’t know I that was a long time ago.

36:03.58
Geoff
Highland is something of a step 40 in paradise is how I how I see it. It’s it’s kind of like ah daybreak. You know it’s just it’s where you go. It’s where the action is I yeah hey I used to have dreams about daybreak back when Daybreak was being built when I was finishing up my time at Byu I was like oh yeah, this is gonna be awesome.

36:05.47
Hailey
Yeah. Yes, guess.

36:20.17
Geoff
And you look at how much house this cost there I’m like oh my gosh. The Utah’s great it’s so affordable I can spend 350 grand and get a whole house and now you look at Daybreak I’m like cool so that’s one point five million dollars take like what anyway, there’s no particular story here I just um.

36:27.69
Hailey
Um, oh my God Oh that’s crazy. Yeah, like no, no first yeah know yeah.

36:37.31
Geoff
I wonder how much they think about I know they’re aware of it but like why the church why does the church not take affordability of housing under its wing I mean we’re bothering to build nice condominiums in in City Creek are we bothering to care about affordable housing developments going in.

36:47.71
Hailey
Right? Yeah, what airport.

36:54.16
Geoff
And places I know it’s It’s very granular and like City planning Urban planning is not sexy and it doesn’t make a lot of headlines but the church getting involved and saying like hey we kind of owe it to our brothers and sisters to make life affordable and we’re not telling you how to like pay people for their jobs or this or that but maybe a little bit more density could be useful. Maybe a better transit could be a good.

37:06.75
Hailey
Yeah,, that’s. Um, yeah, no, That’s yeah I think it’s definitely an issue. Everyone’s going there.

37:13.39
Geoff
Thing. Yeah, maybe we could invest more in affordable housing just things like I Just think it’s interesting. We don’t talk about it really.

37:23.67
Geoff
Seriously, it’s crazy right now all right? Well um, we’ve had a lot of byu stuff now. Yeah, let’s let’s let’s do something really nice and that’s gonna unite everybody talk about Covid So last week.

37:29.50
Hailey
Oh yeah, should we get away from BY you okay, all good old covid. Um.

37:42.60
Geoff
The church sent out a letter to leaders to be read then it say was to be read updating Covid Nineteen guidelines and then when you see this headline. You’re like dude what is happening like what are they going to say at at a churchwide level that’s going to alter this the very course of how we’ve been approaching the pandemic.

37:49.51
Hailey
Not as much.

38:02.15
Geoff
Was baffled by this letter because all it said is you know this said you know we’re grateful. The lord has heard our prayers about how to navigate the global 19 pandemic of course as governmentance as governments begin to modify the requirements for travel masks and other protective measures we offer the following direction. We are now encouraging area, presidencies and consultation with state presidencies. To determine on a local basis. Whether masks should be worn or other precautions should be observed in the various church meetings and activities in doing so local leaders should consider the guidance of local health and government officials and local customs and conditions and then they and then that’s the first part and then they make a point to say.

38:38.17
Hailey
Yeah, temple.

38:39.12
Geoff
Master still required in the temple though and we’ll get to that in a second but that first part I was just confused because that’s been the case all along like nowhere during this process has Salt Lake come out at a church level or a national level and said you’re all wearing masks. You’re all social. It’s been like local decisions. Or lack thereof since day one unless I’m missing something right? i’ve.

38:57.66
Hailey
I mean I guess at the most it would have been the it would have been president Nelson urging you know members to wear masks and get vaccinated but it was that was not an official you know, like statement or decree kind of.

39:06.37
Geoff
Um, which that which they’ve done and yeah.

39:16.45
Hailey
Thing I don’t know I I Wonder yeah maybe because there are there has been a lot of controversy with with that particular statement and I don’t know there are people actually leaving or you know losing their testimonies over that I don’t know maybe. Way of saying you know what? just let your local leaders decide. It’s on them. Yeah.

39:38.25
Geoff
The church is like the church is like it’s an election year. We need to do what the people want Um, that’s what’s happening.

39:43.66
Hailey
Ah, isn’t that what everybody hates to be yes.

39:50.24
Geoff
It’s it is kind of baffling me both because I feel like this is non-guidance like this is the whole time. My state President’s like I’ve been in all these meetings and the state Presidency has been like well you’ve been consulting with the area presidency and they’ve been giving us leeway to figure out what to do based on our local condition and.

39:58.90
Hailey
Yeah, your local leaders local government. Yeah, like you know.

40:04.47
Geoff
And abiding by Virginia law that stuff like and it’s like okay so I do not understand what is different about this honestly other than I don’t if the church is just trying to wash their hands and say you’re getting nothing from Salt Lake anymore ause it like that’s it, you figure this out now we’re not going to say anything more about it which might be the case because I don’t know if you when they announce. The.

40:11.37
Hailey
Exactly like I We don’t It’s not on us.

40:19.33
Hailey
Ah, yeah.

40:24.28
Geoff
General conference is coming up you know and they want us to attend and they renounce the women’s session is back again after you know, ah a one conference hiatus with that 1 session you know for everything but it was curious that in that announcement. The church said they’ll saw a limited number of tickets available. They’ll allow in-person attendance again, it’ll be strictly strictly limited.

40:29.94
Hailey
Oh right.

40:39.38
Hailey
I Saw it? Yeah oh.

40:43.17
Geoff
But nowhere in that release did they say in exercising an abundance of caution because of the Pandemic We want to open this up cautiously and thoughtfully but allow people to come back. They said the only reason for it was because of all the construction on Temple Square which is definitely. Affecting accessibility to the Area. So I Totally understand that and like you know where do you mingle in the hours in between sessions and all none of that’s available right now but they made no mention of Covid which I found very interesting as they did that we talked about that a bit enough so it’s ah it’s It’s kind of funny so I don’t I don’t.

41:06.15
Hailey
Um, it’s too political. It’s hot topic.

41:14.77
Geoff
Yeah, it’s just bizarre to me the whole covid thing right now is so strange to me because I feel like a month ago like I was we were talking about this before we hit the record button but like a month ago it was like dude alomicron is everywhere this is hardcore and we’re hoping yeah everything everything was nothing.

41:24.36
Hailey
Yeah, New York City was like back to March Sixteenth Twenty Twenty yeah mm

41:32.46
Geoff
Everything was was not again. We knew it would peak and crash again like that’s kind of how these things go and that’s so it’s good that that’s been happening. But if you still look at like hospitalization rates. It’s not like this isn’t like February of 2020 or anything like there are still. Yeah this isn’t even as good as like June and July of last.

41:44.79
Hailey
Yeah, or like the summer it’s just like we we are still midwinter here.

41:51.94
Geoff
Like all like it’s still very present and so I’m Frank I know I think everyone’s just exhausted. It feels like we’ve all just like given up because if you look at the numbers. It’s not like this thing crashed so hard. We’re out of the woods and we can just be cool. Yeah, and I know a longtime listeners are tired of me beating a dead horse here but at the same time I’m like. If you want to talk about like the numbers like it just everyone’s reactions right? Now. Do not add up to the where covid currently stands. Thankfully, it’s going down hopefully things will stay good for a long time but but I’m just so like confused because we’ve all dislike collectively decided. That’s it. Whatever.

42:18.14
Hailey
Yeah, so.

42:24.32
Hailey
I Don’t know.

42:26.64
Geoff
Whatever if if my if my elderly neighbor dies. Whatever fine. That’s it. Um, so that’s the 1 thing the other curious one they had here. They talked about masks in temples right? and the church has they they reiterated the stance back in the summer when they they mandated masks among temple patrons and they kind of politely reminded everyone of that requirement which.

42:30.81
Hailey
Ah, oh then you’re 1

42:43.87
Hailey
Like.

42:46.50
Geoff
Implied that people were not obeying the rules but the 1 thing I think is funny here if you read the text it says for the time being masks will still be required in temples where so many who attend are part of an elderly more vulnerable population. That’s one clause and where our desire to keep temples open.

43:00.38
Hailey
Those are.

43:05.91
Geoff
And to have as many as possible participate and where our desires to keep temples open to have as many as possible participate I only think that’s funny because if they’re saying master required for 2 reasons one because of the elderly and 2 our desires to keep temples open and have as many as possible. Be able to participate good.

43:21.93
Hailey
Aha.

43:24.24
Geoff
I’m just curious Why why does that? logic not apply to our sacrament meetings. Do they not also want as many as possible I get it like you can’t zoom in a attempt, an endowment session I get that? Okay, so that’s fine but I still kind of feel like isn’t there a bit of a disconnect here like.

43:25.70
Hailey
2 church meeting. Ah.

43:35.40
Hailey
Ah, with.

43:41.53
Geoff
We don’t care. Is it not essential to keep our meeting houses open is it not essential to let and investigators come Oh that’s the other thing are they saying it’s It’s not essential that I attend like.

43:42.71
Hailey
Ah, oh you’re reading between the lines so we don’t really need to go to our meetings Sunday that’s ah you know you know side side note to that? Um I so we had state conference couple Sundays ago hopefully no one from vice state presence who listens to this but um, um, ah, some of us discovered that our state conference is streamed on Youtube which is probably the worst thing you could ever find out if you’re me. And you kind of grew up thinking state conference was like 1 of those like optional meetings is just how it was in my house wasn’t until I I was adult I was like wait people go to state conference. Okay, and so then to find out like wait I can just go on Youtube and look up my state conference and it’s just there and we can I can be in my first. And not be fighting people for seats with no masks in this huge building and yeah, that was a good find.

44:41.63
Geoff
You know what? while you’ve been talking on youtubetub in here, you don’t have to you don’t have to out your exact steak. You can tell me if it rhymes if if you.

44:49.15
Hailey
I maybe it’s only temporary but the adult session and the like and the general session. We’re both on Youtube and I just watched it from my couch and my pajamas. Um, no no, it was february.

44:58.28
Geoff
What was it over the weekend of January Twenty second and twenty third

45:06.44
Geoff
Oh okay, well this is somewhere else I found some state called the gli steak I don’t know where that is is that even in Colorado.

45:08.48
Hailey
Wealth February thirteenth it was it was it was just last on it. Yeah. Now no, but I mean that was that was just a fin I I was really grateful to my friend that sent me that link and then then well she sent me a link and then she’s like you know it’s just on Youtube you can just search it so i.

45:34.78
Geoff
And that’s all you needed. So.

45:35.78
Hailey
And anyway now anyone who’s in in my stake. Ah now you know you’re welcome.

45:42.99
Geoff
Oh man, what can I say except here wo is all Disney all the time theres that’s cool. All right? What’s we got what else we got.

45:50.83
Hailey
Um, what else we got? um, okay well the Mormon tap. Oh not the Mormon tap with the top the choir I’m sorry I’m sorry I I’m gonna explain why I said that in a minute. Okay, it’s.

45:59.17
Geoff
Um, how dare you and you a b what? a BY you adjacent professionals.

46:10.67
Hailey
In the family. The tabernacle choir um has announced 4 new goals for the choir which I thought was interesting see I I am a a mormon a tabernacle choir family I come from a tabernacle choir family. My grandparents. My.

46:16.70
Geoff
Yeah.

46:30.74
Hailey
Paternal grandparents were both in the choir for years and years and they traveled with the choir and they loved it and um, then my aunt My dad’s sister was in the choir as well. So um, yeah, yeah, so I guess.

46:43.30
Geoff
You go back? This is legit.

46:49.31
Hailey
Eventually I have to move to Utah and be in the choir. but um but yeah but for um, new goals. The first was to increase their or expand their digital audience or basically increase their social media presence as everyone is doing these days. Um. And it says they currently have a social media reach of hundreds of thousands of subscribers which but you know that’s pretty good. That’s quite an influence exactly exactly. So it says they’re assembling a group of experts.

47:16.52
Geoff
That’s pretty good. It’s pretty good but you feel like they’re so famous. They could have more right.

47:26.19
Hailey
Inside and outside the church to discuss how to achieve this goal.

47:29.63
Geoff
What I love here is they’re also talking about they want to attract other audiences and they say they’re going to be moving from cds and Dvds to streaming on social media and evolving with technology.

47:38.58
Hailey
Right? yeah.

47:44.63
Geoff
I’m just for one I love that any statements like we’re gonna move away from Cds I’m like guys that was that was like fifteen years ago but yes but but yeah, yeah, right? What was just just funny because I mean they have like.

47:48.77
Hailey
Ah, no I can I don’t have a zdi player in my car. Yeah.

47:57.68
Geoff
I mean they have like a Spotify station. They’ve got like this’s not like they’re not on streaming so I don’t know what exactly they’re getting out here I know you can still buy those those tabcats Dvds a deret book. That’s the dream but cur what are gonna do.

48:01.82
Hailey
Right.

48:07.48
Hailey
Yeah, so so so I am curious because I don’t even like no I mean I can’t say that like do they have an Instagram I don’t follow them well I need to and they’re called. It’s called at tab cats. Ah.

48:15.99
Geoff
They they do have an Instagram and they they post to stories they they do stuff. Yeah, they’re they’re there and I mean it’s I think the hard thing is I don’t think it’s at tap cat. They don’t like actually they’ve I will say their social media managers have a good sense of humor about tap cats because we’ve.

48:27.22
Hailey
Ah I wish it was was.

48:34.81
Geoff
They they’ve retweeted and responded to a number of our tweets when we at them and we’ve mentioned tabcats and they’ve got they’ve got to I appreciate just like the church news. Yes, the one and only um, yeah I think that’s kind of funny.

48:38.78
Hailey
Ah, oh okay, oh it’s It’s the tabernacle choir.

48:50.90
Hailey
That’s cool I wish it would be like the real tavern here.

48:53.69
Geoff
The real that’s like ours ours has always been the real twin for like a very long time. It has been the time lest see look what you’re doing I Just don’t know what? yeah I Love the group of experts I don’t know what that’s going to mean.

48:55.80
Hailey
Ah, yeah, know that ok I just followed them So I’m helping them with their goals. Yeah I know is it is it like is like tikt talkers you’re like okay.

49:11.50
Geoff
And I really want to. They’re gonna they’re gonna be delightfully a couple years behind they’re gonna have like images of women in the in those robes flossing on Tiktok to.

49:13.54
Hailey
Here’s what you got to do like.

49:24.76
Hailey
They’ll be like ok you got to learn this dance. Oh man. Um, okay so that was one of the goals. The second goal was they want to magnify the choir wants to magnify its role as a missionary tool which hey music.

49:29.64
Geoff
But okay, sorry.

49:41.36
Hailey
Is a great missionary tool I mean I’ve I love I’ve always thought that there you know some people get are way or feel the spirit way more through music than any other way and so for sure I think they should focus on that. It’s a great.

49:52.10
Geoff
Yeah, yeah, no.

50:00.29
Hailey
Great resource for the the gospel in that way or the church. Um, and so yeah, so interesting to see how they’re planning on doing that and then the third objective is they want to be more reflective of the church’s worldwide nature. Ah, president Levitt said an important part of this objective is for the choir to reflect the nature of the church’s global membership so curious to see how they’re going to achieve that goal because that would kind of seem to indicate that they wanted to have a more diverse choir or maybe at least. Guess artists or I don’t know.

50:40.81
Geoff
Yeah, um, this is the one that of course has rubbed some people on social media as we noted in our article about it like I saw 1 comment or even said objective number 3 is to apply and affirmative action and critical race theory to the selection of choir members. The second part of that is great because I’ll know how you.

50:46.94
Hailey
Goo.

50:58.22
Geoff
Apply critical race theory when you’re choosing choremers that doesn’t even make sense. That’s not a thing you apply. It’s just an academic pursuit. But um I wonder what this will be too I mean obviously like this isn’t Utah’s fault I get it like it’s you need to be within a hundred miles of the tabernacle to be in the choir. All.

51:03.38
Hailey
Fifth.

51:15.66
Geoff
All your talent level and all that stuff is is equally important. You know that they they are rigorous with auditions for the tabernac requireir. You don’t just get into it Willy -nilly it definitely takes a lot of talent you have to be able to sitere a lot of complex music pretty well to be able to be in the tabernac choir and that’s why they sound so great and you have to be able to do that and live within a hundred miles

51:29.30
Hailey
Um. I just checked the map and I am ah about four hundred miles outside ah boiled.

51:34.40
Geoff
Of the tabernacle so you can go to rehearsals and.

51:40.32
Geoff
Sorry you know the only the only non-ut let’s see looking at this at their map. The only non-utons who could go. It’s basically if you’re there’s a little if you’re in Evanston or if you’re in like very Southern Idaho you could get in on some of that too.

51:47.69
Hailey
No there, there’s Wyoming you can be in Evanston oh Southern Idaho almost Nevada so close many rhythm.

51:58.78
Geoff
Not quite wendover doesn’t make it for many reasons, many many reasons. Um, so I but I like I totally get that a choir has to function and you need people to be able to come to rehearsal and that’s fine, but because of that the base feeding the choir is extremely white.

52:06.65
Hailey
Yeah, you have to go to rehearsal. But.

52:17.66
Geoff
And it and it simply is not reflective of the church overall and the church’s demographics right? and so I don’t think the the church trying to the churches and they have not said anything like so what we’re gonna do is like turn away a perfectly qualified white person so that we can bring in a less qualified minority. They haven’t said that I’m just curious what they’re gonna do.

52:21.29
Hailey
Okay.

52:34.72
Hailey
Okay, here here’s the thing though here’s the thing though I mean this these days I mean you can do most things over technology and having been familiar with.

52:37.48
Geoff
Um, what they’re going to do to to affect this to bring in more diversity right.

52:53.17
Hailey
Performing world I think there would be a way to send I mean people you could have individuals that lived across the country receive their music work on their music. Do some Zoom sessions and then a week before the conference fly out to Salt Lake and have. Multiple you know, rigorous rehearsals and then do the performance have like an outreach choir members. It’s totally feasible.

53:18.49
Geoff
Yeah, like that could be cool I I want it to go even farther I want us to invest church resources Whether whether that’s from our massive slush fund. Whatever it may be um I you know I would even ship in I would chip in on my tithing slip to support this I think it’d be cool if they could bring in members from around the world on like a workst study type.

53:25.94
Hailey
Um, yeah.

53:36.66
Hailey
Oh oh, that’s even better so cool.

53:38.39
Geoff
Thing for like twelve month stints but the church enough to put them up in housing it would have to be a whole thing right? This would be ah, an expensive endeavor. But how cool would that be and for for better and worse. It would allow saints from elsewhere to also like be in Utah and see what. Churches like it. Its nucleus you know for a stretch of time that could be explain too. Yeah.

53:56.85
Hailey
Well yeah, also it’s a calling right? So so you can it could be couldn’t it be like a mission couldn’t they have young people from other countries. You know I mean we I don’t know it would just be fun I think to see all ages I mean if that was your whole mission and.

54:04.81
Geoff
So and that’s the other one I’ve thought I’ve wondered about yeah, that’s.

54:16.71
Hailey
You could Also you know work at Temple Square or whatever. But then you’re in the choir and you have an audition and.

54:20.60
Geoff
And and that would be fascinating because the other thing the age requirement for tab. The tabcats is you have to be between 25 55 years of age to join it so they would have to revise that I love the idea of how we do different types of missions nowadays. They’ve tried to because now they say even when you turn in your papers.

54:28.15
Hailey
Oh. Um, Ah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

54:39.88
Geoff
You don’t say like oh well, you know if you have like a disability or something like that. You don’t fill out different papers like everyone applies to be a missionary and you just send it in and what they call you to do is now what might could be different. You could be a service missionary. You could be a proselytizing missionary and the idea is to take away a lot of stigma from the what used to be thought of as like you know, lesser you.

54:49.78
Hailey
Yeah. Um, yeah I If there was a singing and performing mission I mean I I would fight everyone and I would do it.

54:58.77
Geoff
Lesser emissions quote Unquote or what have you? Why not act.

55:05.66
Geoff
Yeah, why not do it that be amazing. Actually I mean I know that that that becomes very specific because it’s like all right. We’ve got this wonderful. We’ve got this wonderful sister who wants to go on a mission who lives in Uruguay and we think she’s we think she’s Tabcat’s material we think we can call her to this right? like I think it’s hard. But I think that’d be cool.

55:12.34
Hailey
A. Yeah. Yeah, no I think that’d be great and I think I hope someone is listening. They should do that. But I know we don’t know the plans right right? But that there’s definitely some potential for.

55:25.48
Geoff
Ah, be need.

55:31.12
Geoff
I just can’t I mean obviously all all these things are goals they have they haven’t fleshed out hall. They’re gonna do them. Yeah, we don’t know the plans but and this has the first presidency’s support by the way we want to be clear. They were clear about that like they’ve pitched this to the leaders and they’re like awesome hit it. Do it.

55:41.13
Hailey
Um, cool stuff. That’s great I like it and then let’s see the last part. The last goal was to increase worldwide visibility. Um, which is funny because I just always assume everyone has heard of the choir but maybe. Not I mean I’m sure there’s still places they haven’t gone to or touched. But so I mean that would imply they would want to travel more but um, but they did cancel their tour for this year they

56:17.33
Geoff
Yeah, the heritage tour is over they post. They’ve postponed it twice already and now they just said it’s over.

56:20.71
Hailey
Yeah, they just announced that. Yeah yeah, which yeah I mentioned my grandparents are in it I mean that’s all I remember is I’m just talking about all the awesome trips they took and all the like souvenirs that they brought home and they would just talk on and on about. Um, how much they loved all these countries they visited so I for sure was like I think they’re in it for the trips which it was they made it look pretty good. So so kind of so I’m sad for the members who have had it canceled 3 years in a row. Yeah.

56:50.12
Geoff
I’m curious about the.

56:55.39
Geoff
I’m curious about the funding mechanism then how when they go on. Do they fundraise does the search just just comp it like I mean I wonder how they do that I have no idea and 1 thing that is a benefit of having it all be very Utah based is culturally. It’s probably less of an issue if you tell your boss like.

56:59.98
Hailey
I Don’t know I’m gonna ask my I’m gonna ask my aunt about that.

57:13.46
Geoff
Hey I’m in the tabernac requireir and we need to go tour europe for a couple of weeks and like because a lot of those things like that you know it’s not everyone has tons of time off I have to imagine if you have sympathetic employers who get church culture a bit more. It might make things like that easier to carve out special allowances to do certain things like that I would guess.

57:29.40
Hailey
Right? right? yeah.

57:33.10
Geoff
I Mean whether that’s like favoriteitism towards members of the church versus other random member you know, non latter-day Saint employees who might also have you know pursuits and I Yeah okay I got that but yeah could be fun. Yeah said they canceled the heritage tour that was gonna be cool. They were going to tour around famous locales relevant to the churches.

57:37.72
Hailey
Um, yeah. Yeah.

57:52.76
Geoff
European Pioneer Days but now it’s it’s all for naught. Very sad.

57:55.99
Hailey
That is sad maybe next year guys next year.

58:00.39
Geoff
Now Hailey I know ah your kids are out of the the key demo at this point but we had the friend to friend broadcast over the weekend I watched it with my kids. Ah I love these things I’m glad they did another one and my understanding is they’re gonna have.

58:06.20
Hailey
Yes. Oh yeah, how was it I.

58:17.45
Geoff
3 of them this year which is great I like them announcing some regularity with it because the first one they did was this really cool thing and my initial reaction was like where has this been during covid like this is great. They should be doing this a lot. Um for those. Ah unfamiliar. It’s ah it’s basically a broadcast designed specifically for primary age kids.

58:17.83
Hailey
Great mm Oh yeah.

58:33.49
Geoff
They send out you can watch it whenever you know after the fact kids basically host it. Yeah, they they talk the camera and I just yeah I’ve loved it I Think it’s a great undertaking this next. But this new one was shorter than the last.

58:34.91
Hailey
That’s so great and kids are actually on it right? like yeah I love that? yeah.

58:45.76
Hailey
Um.

58:47.91
Geoff
If I am not mistaken just from watching cause I feel like it was nearly an hour long before but this was like 25 minutes um you know and they meet with members of the primary general presidency and they have cute vignettes and different skills and things and stories and it all varies. So that was cool in and of itself. But what was really interesting about this one is it will actually be.

58:56.30
Hailey
This isn’t.

59:01.54
Hailey
Yeah.

59:07.54
Geoff
Broadcast with different hosts in different languages so traditionally like a lot of things in the church created in english and then dubbed or subtitled into other languages. In this case though I bet you cannot possibly guess what the other 2 languages would be at.

59:10.16
Hailey
So me, Yeah, yeah.

59:21.60
Hailey
Ah, oh um, Spanish could say um no I a portuguese right? I couldn’t think of any other exciting languages.

59:24.66
Geoff
You? Oh yeah.

59:31.00
Geoff
Yeah, yeah, those are the 2 So yeah, those are the big ones. It’s you know the only 3 languages and you know they’ve got the ah the full quad in all 4 you can. You can actually get a quad in spanish and portuguese as well now.

59:44.97
Hailey
Oh what.

59:47.67
Geoff
And english and that’s it the quad was reserved just for english for a very long time because the church did not produce its own cut of the bible until recent history in the other languages Soto is this is cool though. They didn’t dub it. They actually brought in native speaking there was these this explorer element this friend to friend talked about basically 3 things you make you’re baptized.

59:52.90
Hailey
Ah, okay, so yeah.

01:00:00.95
Hailey
Yeah.

01:00:06.16
Geoff
To the holy ghost and like what the sacrament means and kind of explaining that and they framed it like you were sort of going camping like exploring through the woods and coming upon different things but I just think it’s great that they did this and all through the whole broadcast completely other languages I want to find them in the other broadcast because it’s 1 thing to have the explorer hosts and the other kid hosts.

01:00:10.45
Hailey
Oh that’s so cute.

01:00:16.76
Hailey
Yeah, how come on.

01:00:23.54
Hailey
Yeah.

01:00:24.56
Geoff
Speak their language I don’t know what they did with the primary general presidency members if they let them if they spoke in the tongue or what they did I’m curious about that and maybe that speaks to their capabilities I Noticed the.

01:00:28.93
Hailey
Oh m.

01:00:39.72
Geoff
President of the primary was the only one not to appear in person only via a video and I was the whole time I was like is this like cause a covid stuff like the president would be the one who think it would be there or maybe she had to record her remarks in different languages and it was easier to do that off-site I don’t know I don’t know. But.

01:00:46.29
Hailey
Um, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, no, That’s great I Love that they’re incorporating the other languages but I Also love it from the standpoint of. Anytime that you know the church seems to be supporting like artistic endeavors and giving people jobs and to do creative things and you know produce these things I think it’s great to champion the arts.

01:01:17.43
Geoff
Yeah, the original one is forty four forty foot to champion the arts I don’t think though if that’s how the church is looking at it as champion the arts but but I’m with you in spirit I just don’t know if that’s their mentality or out it. No, it was good. It was good I love that they do these and I hope they’ll keep.

01:01:28.90
Hailey
Ah, well I will watch it and be the judge of myself.

01:01:36.43
Geoff
Keep them up Covid or no Covid I think friend to friend is great. Kids need this. It’s useful.

01:01:37.65
Hailey
Yeah, no, that’s awesome. It’s great. But I mean kids you know they can they can relate to it and it’s more you know, exciting than maybe going to state conference and listening to a talk.

01:01:49.85
Geoff
State Conference I maintain is the just like the most needed to be remote of all church meetings. It is a nightmare with children and and it’s just I feel like it is.

01:01:56.35
Hailey
Yeah, it’s just it’s just not for children. It is not for children.

01:02:07.28
Geoff
I Feel like it’s more impactful if you can just do a stream of it forever just forever and ever and ever and.

01:02:11.40
Hailey
Yeah, and you can my stake but you didn’t hear that for me. Oh no, please don’t take it away for anyone’s listening. Ah.

01:02:20.60
Geoff
So I’m gonna find it I mean I’m going I’m going to embed your state conference I at least know the city you live in and that should be enough I can get to the bottom of this haileley. It’s gonna be good. Ah real quick couple couple random ones to mention here. Um, before we go president Nelson.

01:02:29.38
Hailey
Oh no.

01:02:36.18
Hailey
Go Return helsa.

01:02:40.20
Geoff
Inspected the roof of the Salt Lake temple and I love the this living headline. It’s this clot why 97 year old president Nelson went up scaffolding to inspect the Salt Lake temple roof I mean first of all, it’s because he’s president Nelson he doesn’t mess around this is president Nelson right? He’s like yeah I’m going up there the whole thing.

01:02:51.23
Hailey
Right? Yeah, yeah, don’t tell me what to do so.

01:02:57.15
Geoff
And so that’s what’s going to happen this. They talked about this on the so I love this quote though from Brent Roberts who’s the managing director of Church’s special projects I’m not sure any prophet has ever done that before or been that high before.

01:03:12.43
Hailey
Um, okay.

01:03:15.90
Geoff
Like did he he kind of walked into that one knowing that some people be like yeah no president of the shirt. No profit’s ever been that high before have the.

01:03:19.44
Hailey
Oh my gosh, but well that could be but.

01:03:28.56
Geoff
But I like that president Nelson cares so much about the nitty gritty of the temple he says as they he asked specific questions about the trusses all these sorts like you he wanted to go up there and really really see it so good for you good for you president Nelson I can agree.

01:03:39.79
Hailey
That’s great. Well that no, that’s good I mean I’m terrified of heights so I would be like no thanks. That’s a hard pass somebody else go up there So I’m very impressed.

01:03:49.48
Geoff
So when you see like on Instagram pictures of people like ah looming on a little rock over a massive gorge in like Norway you’re just like no and and and and and and and yeah.

01:03:55.72
Hailey
Yeah, no, no or there’s this new thing in New York City where you can like climb the top you’re like basically scaling a skyscraper like out in the wind. Why why would I want to do that.

01:04:08.49
Geoff
Are those the ones we you know like I know there’s one at the cn tower in Toronto where they latch you in and and you at the very top and you like lean out like that kind of thing. Yeah I would never do it.

01:04:13.21
Hailey
Yet republic. Yes, But why oh I’m not doing that.

01:04:22.64
Geoff
That does not appeal to me at all oh like there’s that right at the stratosphere in Vegas where all it does is tilt towards the ground and just like goes forward and then stops and I’m like dude if the bricks fail on this thing. It’s over.

01:04:27.25
Hailey
Ah. No, and that’s all I think about in any of those situations. So yeah, no that’s So thanks so ah um well I guess one thing we didn’t talk about is this past week was the candy bomber passed away. You know the candy bomber gail yeah, um, the first time I ever heard of him was when he was in meet the mormons and I thought it was such a charming story about how he um.

01:04:50.89
Geoff
Yeah Gail Halverson

01:05:00.70
Geoff
Yeah, he made he was big on that.

01:05:10.65
Hailey
Back in his days when he is in the or when he’s serving in the air force the kids in Germany he would parachute candy down to him after he’d done his to or taken his other cargo has done his other drops and he was known for that and I thought that was. Anyway, he he um, lived in provost and he was a hundred and one years old and he passed away. Um, yeah.

01:05:37.65
Geoff
What a cool guy I mean I love that the berlin this is all you know he started this during the berlin air lift back in the the late 40 s um, just so cool and I love that this is what he wasn’t limited to that. He we got famous for that but he engaged in humanitarian work. Um.

01:05:48.60
Hailey
So um, yeah, ah.

01:05:56.85
Geoff
Relief efforts with candy and toy drops across America and you know in Bosnia Albania Kosovo Japan Guam Iraq the micronesian islands like this man, he he got it. He used his skills and his talents and the things he was blessed with to impact the lives of others for better even if it seems like.

01:06:03.40
Hailey
Ah, yeah.

01:06:15.41
Hailey
Yeah, well yeah, and and it made an impact like some you know he I mean these kids like remembered him and like you know, talked about it and I think 1 lady wrote a book about it. Children’s book. So it’s pretty cool.

01:06:16.13
Geoff
You know, almost silly like it’s a bunch of candy for kids. No, that’s that’s awesome I mean like for these Berlin kids that was who.

01:06:31.84
Geoff
Yeah, kreka.

01:06:34.40
Hailey
Um, the way I found out about it actually was um, elder updorf’s Instagram he posted a picture of himself with Gail and then you know how you put like multiple yeah and then Harrison Ford and I was like nice flex so door. He’s like oh so sad to this my friend like.

01:06:42.33
Geoff
Oh Harrison Ford yeah that one. Yeah, it’s got a.

01:06:53.69
Hailey
Candy bover and here’s Harrison Ford in the swipe swife right for on solo I was like all right I see you.

01:07:03.14
Geoff
I Oh man. Um I Only hope he ribbed him a little bit like terce and for being like hey I’ve never crashed my plane and just saying.

01:07:13.16
Hailey
I Hope so I know so was it just some like cool guy pilot conference or something.

01:07:23.00
Geoff
They’re about the same age too like I think I think Google commercial I like yeah Harrison Ford’s like yeah Harrison Fords like I think they’re within like 1 or two years of each other. Yeah, never forget Harrison Ford is much older than we think people he was already like 40 when he made star wars so he’s like.

01:07:25.90
Hailey
No way. Oh that’s wild I know how old when he made servers forty. Oh that’s wild.

01:07:39.63
Geoff
He was almost forty or so I mean well what you know? That’s what 77 let’s have been it’s been it’s been 45 years since star wars so right then.

01:07:45.81
Hailey
Yeah, so I wonder how old he was like when you did like fugitive Probably it’s but it’s more fun to sit here and wonder.

01:07:48.80
Geoff
Well, we could do some simple math here and help our listeners if you figure out how old Harrison Ford was when he made the fugitive. Let us know, please let us know we will.

01:07:58.53
Hailey
But if somebody knows a way to figure out how old he is. You’ll get some candy but not from the candy bomber sorry.

01:08:08.17
Geoff
No, what I’m going to mail. You is an ah envelope full of fundip powder and let the but and and let the postal service do without what they will. That is my oh yeah, fugitive was what 93 so point Twenty nine years ago so he was only.

01:08:14.30
Hailey
It’s probably not good to send that in the mail. Okay Harrison Ford is 79 years old wow

01:08:27.62
Geoff
His late 40 s then when he made the fugitive right? or is that late 50 S.

01:08:27.97
Hailey
Well now I have to now I have to look up. Okay, elder ukdorf is 81 so they are super close. They’re wow contemporaries became full circle.

01:08:39.70
Geoff
This is dynamite.

01:08:47.10
Geoff
I’m just gonna name this episode contemporaries and put a picture of those 2 on the on the artwork for the episode and make no sense for anybody Reswick today’s well it’s been a good week all right.

01:08:54.63
Hailey
Know And what.

01:08:58.10
Geoff
Folks? Well we’ve we’ve done it please go to this week in http://mormons.com and follow us on social media instagram Twitter and Facebook all those good places where we have more followers than the tabernac requireir. It’s not true, but I want to believe it is ah and i.

01:09:10.96
Hailey
Ah, they have a 37000 plus me just make your goals make your 4 goals known.

01:09:17.18
Geoff
I don’t have that maybe to just make my goals everyone our goal is to beat the tabern choir a number of followers then I will be a true influencer. Um, thanks again to our Patreon supporters hey three bucks a month helps us keep this thing going so please go to http://patreon.com/thisweek at mormons and make your ah.

01:09:25.20
Hailey
Make it happen 6 different people.

01:09:36.90
Geoff
Donation there and then I get to claim it on my taxes and it actually hurts me. So if you want to give me pain. That’s another way to do because it’s it’s not tax-eductible. So thanks to all of you who do that Hailey thanks so much for being here I love having you on appreciate your time and always.

01:09:46.67
Hailey
So much fun. Always just a pleasure.

01:09:52.96
Geoff
Delight and then tell then everybody and we hope you have a great week. We’ll be back again next week to do more of this and we’re it’s almost time to run up for conference season. So we’re excited about that. So for haileley I’m Geoff this has been this week in mormons have a good one but-bye everybody.

01:10:01.46
Hailey
Are bye.

 

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